Taking the filthy lucre - Part One

Goodness Gracious, I should be paid for wading through this shit. But, wading, or - burrowing, as I like to call it, can be rewarding, when, after hours, days weeks, you finally read something that makes you bolt up. You see, I'm reading the transcript of the first day's IICSA civil justice hearing again, and finally, finally, on page 105 (or 27/93) the conversation turns to - how dare they even mention, the mere - possibility of  'dishonest claims' 

It's sometime between 11.54 am and the lunch break, it's 'session 2' and the insurer's are in. They always come in after the solicitors, that's how it works guys and gals. You see, no one gets a brass farthing, unless them underwriting your claim, say so. Your claim has to be worth the risk, your Slater & Gordon type firm is willing to make. It's extremely complicated, so much so, Mr Scorer has to explain it to his clients repeatedly, so I'm not even going there. But, before we get to the insurance guys, lets reflect upon something the lawyers say regarding your cat in hell's chance, claim, if the defendant is not solvent !

 cc

 The merits, likely to be true, and provable, don't come into it for Mr Scorer's vicarious liability claims though, unless, there's a chance that the defendant dares to enter litigation, and, yes, some of them do you know, some of them do !

Now, just THREE of the Savile NHS claims entailed significant sums of money. Remember the stink about how little the victims got, while the lawyers seemingly, raked it in ?

No expert opinions sought there then ! No, trawling through lever-arch files going back ten, twenty years. Of course, Savile was dead, and he was still solvent, so hey, no need to prove anything, not even negligence. The NHS employed Savile, they are thus - vicariously liable ! 

In March 2015, it was reported that THREE victims had been paid £60,000 between them. Liz Dux represented fifty claimants at the time 

Just a month ago, 47 had been paid an average of just £9,500 

 
Now, get this ! Of the three that attracted the big money, and thus, we assume, some input from some expert or another, one was the woman who claimed to have been raped by a porter when she was 12. Yes, that one ! 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/869495/Jimmy-Savile-victims-NHS-patients-abused-payout

I'm not going there again ! 

http://rabbitaway.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/after-savile-no-more-tears-enough-is.html

Not sure, how much of that £40,000, any of those three victims actually received ! What's all the secrecy about, for goodness sake ? 

Mr Daniels is referring to his costs, not the claimants payout. Mr Scorer, clearly has problems with defendant's solicitors  defending their clients ! The bastards, how dare they !

It's not easy, working out how all this fits into the Savile case. Or, any historic child sex abuse case, for that matter. One statement that got my attention, clearly nothing to do with him was this ! Is this true ? Really ? 

Unless, of course, someone dares ask the question : Did the NHS have any experts of their own, who were doctors and nurses, or even psychiatrists, when those Savile assaults were alleged to have taken place ? From memory, I don't remember any being consulted by Sue Proctor's crew, though, as always, I'm always happy to be corrected. 

But, back to the lawyers, and their risks, and their limitations. 

But, it's not, just about the money, apparently, some claimants actually want some sort of apology to go with their early settlement ! The real surprise being, that, they rarely seem to get one ! 

From six 'victims' to none ! Poor Liz

Goodness Gracious, I'm indebted to 'Linda' for this tweet and it's link to a press story that nicely links up  with my current research ! 

The article, published on November 19th 2016, exposed the dubious practice employed by some lawyers, in prisons ! Nowhere else mind, just prisons ! 

Slater and Gordon actually admitted that it had submitted claims on behalf of people they hadn't even met.

These 'letters' of claim, civil claim that is, were submitted after June 2016. Bear in mind, that Henriques had himself suggested in January, that Janner should have been charged on three counts, in 2007. 

The firm wrote: 'We have not been able to meet personally with our client, who is an inmate.' It added: 'There is no police statement'.

In some other cases, the firm says it is basing the damages claims on police interviews and statements.

 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3951434/Lawyers-chase-cash-child-sex-abuse-victims-ve-never-met-never-police-statement.html

Grevile Janner died in December 2015. This was Liz Dux's reaction 

 Liz Dux, abuse lawyer at Slater and Gordon, who represents six of Lord Janner's alleged victims, said: "This is devastating news for my clients. They have waited so long to see this case come before the courts, to be denied justice at the final hurdle is deeply frustrating. 

Worth a read - provides an interesting timeline regarding the Janner history 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/12059939/Labour-peer-Greville-Janner-has-died-after-a-long-illness.html 

Dux was determined to get closure for her six claimants, the fight would go on 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3367112/Lord-Janner-dies-aged-87.htmlhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3367112/Lord-Janner-dies-aged-87.html

Going back to the November 2016 article, S and G were keen to point out that they were NOT representing any Operation Midland claimants 

Funny ! I was under the impression that Janner fell within the scope of Operation Midland. But I'll come back to that later. You see, the late Lord's family fought back, many of the allegations were challenged, and - whoosh, just like that Liz's 6 'victims' became NONE ! 

 
They would subject all claimants to intense cross-examination !

Only proper scrutiny of this claim could have ferreted out that information. WHY hadn't this been done by the solicitors acting on his behalf ? Was this one of the 'one in eight or nine' claimants that pass muster with Richard Scorer's firm - Slater and Gordon ? Looks that way doesn't it folks ? 

 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/28/lord-janner-sex-abuse-case-collapses-six-claimants-abandon-legal/

Goodness Gracious indeed ! 

 https://rabbitaway.blogspot.co.uk/2017/11/slater-and-gordons-one-in-eight-or-nine.html

Getting back to Operation Midland - I'll leave Matthew Scott to explain what a disaster that turned out to be

 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/10/11/operation-midland-was-a-disaster-from-start-to-finish-the-public/

 

A letter to Alexis

Goodness Gracious, don't take your eye off the ball for five minutes, someone may make a mistake, and no one will bother to correct it ! Worse still, no one will actually notice. No one except awkward folk like me. I'm talking about money, the costs and funding of child sex abuse cases, those that involve a lot of risk to the company bringing the case that is ! Bear with me, I'm no expert, and neither do I want to be. My remit is purely, fact checking. You see, this inquiry has been going on for a few years now, it's costing a hell of a lot of money, so the very least it and it's core participants from the legal world, should be able to do is - 

Tell me, what is the income threshold for funding via legal aid ? Here's what Garsden and Scorer, think, it is 

He thinks the income threshold is £2,700 a year ? That figure is actually per year, not per month, as far as I can make out, and I have checked several sources. It is rather complicated, so - as usual happy to be corrected. Remember, we're dealing with legal aid for civil claims for sexual abuse, it's important to know, which bit of the law your case fits into. 

Here's what the government says 

By way of a slight apology, the IICSA twitter folks actually did link the transcript of the seminar, that very day ! See what I mean about missing something ?

The first few pages are all you need to read today folks

https://www.iicsa.org.uk/key-documents/919/view/iicsa291116_a.pdf 

How did the press react to that alleged ' sort of poverty gap'  ?

Is this what Scorer meant when he said his firm only actually proceeded with about one in eight or nine claims ? Who knows ? The Savile claims and their costs, were all met by the estate itself, no need for public funding (legal aid). But, that's another story ! The IICSA inquiry isn't about Savile type civil claims. It's about the bigger picture ... those poor souls allegedly abused in settings where some organisation allegedly failed in their duty of care. 

But, before I'd want to know about that, I want someone to tell me, if what Garsden and Scorer say is true. Are legal fees really a 'barrier to justice' for the poor ? Can one of those dozen or so lawyers in the room, please ask their admin staff to check the income threshold for legal aid please ? Thanks 

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2016/nov/29/legal-fees-are-a-barrier-to-justice-for-sex-abuse-victims-inquiry-hears






 

The Civil Justice System Seminar Day One

Bloody hell, it was hard work tracking down the transcript of the video uploaded by the IICSA people, that I used in my last post ! This one 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PeR6XFx5ys&t=383s 

 I assume it is the official IICSA folk who are behind this youtube account. It's not very well laid out, I mean, look at the 'playlists' 

Try watching one of those THREE videos

OK, there's plenty of videos in the 'videos' section. But, let's just take the one I'm most interested in, to begin with. What is it ? When did this seminar take place ? Where's all the information folks ? Aren't you getting paid enough to do the most simplest of things ? 

Fortunately, there are obsessives like me who like facts and like to know exactly what's what. That's why, shortly after finishing my last effort, I decided to go looking for a transcript of my video. I mean, surely there had to be one ? It took some time, in fact, I've just found it. You see, without knowing exactly what it is you're looking for, it's darned hard to find.

https://www.iicsa.org.uk/key-documents/919/view/iicsa291116_a.pdf 

So, now you have it ! Now, you can hear what MR Scorer et al have to say about what sort of cases they take on and why. I'll be burrowing into this in the next few days ... or so. Don't hurry me folks, I'm taking it easy these days, but I'm still here. Ain't going nowhere, until I get some sort off Justie for Jimmy !

Apparently, they're having some problems getting people to engage with them. LOL, not many 'survivors, in that room full of lawyers. And, I'm not being nasty, you see, I'm learning a bit about stuff like limitation and public funding etc etc. But, I need a break right now. Plenty of time, we have a new seam of information now folks. A sort of lawyers version of the Pollard Report, just not as easy to access, or read ! Someone give them a bit more public money, that should help !

I count FIVE 'survivors' I lost count of the lawyers !